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I love me some Forever 21.
When I have a bad day, I’ll stop by their two-story store in Union Square and buy myself an adorable will-rip-in-three-weeks-but-who-cares- because-it’s-so-adorable shirt. When I have a good day, I’ll push through the crowds on Broadway and purchase a bright sweater that 17 other girls probably have, but because it’s so bright and cute, I don’t care. Yes, Forever 21 is my fountain of cheap and trendy.
But it may also be my Bible Study Group in disguise.
What am I talking about, you ask? Well, the other day, after throwing one of their trademarked yellow shopping bags onto my bed, I happened to catch a glimpse of the underside of said bag. What I saw there stopped my spiritual- yet-vehemently-non- organized-religious heart dead.
John 3:16.
There it was, in tiny, black letters. A Bible verse. A freaking Bible verse!
Screaming for my roommate, I had her verify that what I was staring at was indeed one of the more pro-Christian verses out there.
“For God so loved the world”, John 3:16 begins, “that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
Oh yeah. There’s no denying. Forever 21 is all about the Big Man Upstairs.
Apparently, stamping their bags with “evidence of faith” is not a new development for Forever 21. Don Chang, the “deeply religious” owner of the chain, began putting his favorite verse on his bags after realizing that the California fast-food restaurant In-N-Out Burger had been doing the same thing for years.
Now, I consider myself a tolerant human being, and even though I really don’t do organized religion these days, I did spend 18 or so years as a Roman Catholic, so I know that all the controversy and suffocation of big religion is often countered by beauty and acceptance. But look, I feel weird buying clothes from a store that propagates messages I don’t agree with.
Every time I buy a shirt, does Forever 21 donate money to a specific church group? To a big business or politician associated with a church? Could they be using my money for missionary practices? I don’t agree with most missionary practices. Could I actually be funding something I don’t agree with simply by buying a tank top?
So many questions, and nothing but a pile of clothes for an answer.
Help me out here, precious readers. Religious or not, I want to hear your take on this whole John 3:16 debacle. Is it no big thang, or does it freak you out?
84 Comments
i notice the bible verse on the bag a long time ago.. and it really freaked me out…
in and out burger does that on the bottom of their cups too. the busines is family owned and operated and they are religous people just trying to send some positive vibes out into the world.
yea im from california (if you couldn’t tell from my name) and in and out does put john 3:16 on the bottom of soft drink cups and proverb 3:5 on the bottom of milk shake cups.
personally i have no problem with it but I can see how some people would be offended.
I think I’m more worried about where the money is going than the fact that the verses are on the bag. I never even noticed them.
It’s been going on for a while and you haven’t noticed…Also, if someone was interested in religion but didn’t know how to start and they saw a verse on a bag and maybe it helped them, that’s good.
I think you’re making a big deal over nothing. Grow up.
I’m gonna say… if you’re worried about Forever 21 funding Fred Phelps or something, do a little research. But remember that Christians have been dealing with this stuff for *ages*. Sure, some of the more conservative Christian groups have started boycotts, but you know what most of us do?
We roll our eyes and get over it. It’s a pretty hard-core reality check, but how much are we really taking out of the hypothetical missionaries’ pockets by directing our individual purchasing power away from a store like that? It may make us feel better to act on our indignation (or maybe not), but Ralph Waldo Emerson was on to something when he told us to quit donating relatively insignificant amounts to charities and either focus on the people around us or make the people we’re donating to our *own* people.
That’s a politically incorrect quote, but think how much more of a difference you could make by, say, offering a few alternatives to church outreach projects? (And I feel weird saying this, because I’m a Christian!) By far the highest concentration of missions outreach projects in the Christian church today is in America. This is your back yard.
If you feel that strongly about the threat of encroaching Christianity, turn your focus where it matters. We church kids have been told to boycott K-Mart, Burger King, and a host of other places that ‘fund immoral ideologies’– only to miss out on some of the really horrifying stuff, like which companies use overseas slave labor and which ones pump out buttloads of pollutants into our atmosphere.
I’d say: if the company is in-your-face public about their intentions to support abortion clinic bombings or something insane like that, or if you’re contributing significant portions of cash, go ahead and keep your money out of their hands, but don’t do like so many ineffective Christians and spend all your time worrying about what sneaky, horrible things your pennies might be supporting. Make a difference where it counts: volunteer at non-religious after-school programs, bring cooked food to elderly shut-ins, fund renovation projects for low-income housing, and get involved in your community. That’s what most local missions programs *do*.
After all, why do you think they need funding?
Its a free market so we consumers have a few choices.
a) Don’t purchase the product
b) Ask the business to reconsider their stance
c) Stop complaining and purchase away
And this goes with about anything. I don’t appreciate those who complain just because they have the breath to do so and continue on without offering any solutions.
One wouldn’t find a member of PETA in real fur and slurping on some shark fin soup while attending a dog fight would they?
No big deal. You’re harking over nothing. It’s his business and he can put whatever he wants, where ever he wants because it’s his store chain, and that’s business for you. You don’t like it, don’t shop there. You’re complaining over nothing. I’m so sick of you people whining over being “offended” by the most harmless things. It’s a plastic bag with a bible verse underneath it! You JUST now notice that was there!? Get over it, move on, and get a life! Next we’ll probably have someone posting about how they hate seeing “THANK YOU” on their grocery bag because it supports the part of christian values that says you should be kind to one another. Seriously, Grow up!
You know…if you read the article closely, you can see that the writer isn’t being crazy judgmental…she’s just asking for opinions.
Personal attacks are a little much, don’t you think?
Offensive to those who may not share Forever 21’s views on religion I can see why this could offend someone. At the same time, it is a non confrontational way of saying “Hey this is what we stand for” without being too outspoken or throwing it in someone’s face. It is easily avoidable and if it really upsets you then boycott but I find it comforting to think that a company can casually do something like that and leave the customer some curiosity as to what the verse is all about. It is a way to witness yet easily avoidable all at once which I think to be absolutely brilliant.
I shop at Forever21 ALL the time. The first time I saw that stamped on the bottom of my bag I thought, “Huh, that’s weird.” But it didn’t offend me in any way whatsoever. The first amendment gives the rights of freedom of speech, religion, press, petition, and peaceful assembly. Even though it isn’t speech in the spoken sense, printing John 3:16 is a form of speech and religious freedom. You don’t have to believe in it or agree with it, but the beauty of America is that you have the right to do stuff like that. If I owned a business and felt like putting my favorite quote on the bottom of a bag, I would certainly do so even if it may possibly offend someone. I have a Jewish friend, and I asked if she was offended by the print on the bag and she couldn’t care less. I think most of the people that are offended are a little too sensitive or too into their own beliefs to accept anything different. If you’re offended, don’t buy from the store. It’s as simple as that, but don’t get your panties in a twist just because someone believes differently than you. We’re all entitled to our own opinions, and we shouldn’t be judged by that.
Well, most owners donate to campaigns but remeber that campaign finance laws do not let them donate more than a certain amount. Other than that Forever 21 probably does not fund missions and stuff. They just write the verse number so their intention clearly is not divise, its probably just meant to brighten the day of christians who notice it. If they wanted to be divisive or in your face to non christians they would write an anti gay verse or such. So it think if you really like the clothes, you should not worry about buying them
While it is this is a controversial topic for some bizarre reason, maybe he simply liked the quote attached to the verse and decided it would b e alittle catchy for whomever decided to look up John 3:16 and try and relate the quote to themselves and perhaps have a nice day because of it. Hmmm?
Check out this article (3rd page is most relevant):
http://radaronline.com/from-the-magazine/2008/02/forever_21_retail_copyright_infringement_01.php
It says that the owners of F21, besides giving money to their local church, go on missionary trips and gave (reportedly) 3 mill to their local seminary.
Who knows how accurate that is but I really hate contributing money to religious causes if I don’t know exactly what they’re doing. Many groups do wonderful things, but a huge groups of others screw up people they try to help. Not on purpose, of course, but unknowingly. So I may think twice about that adorable-shirt-that-will-rip-in-three-weeks, with the extra thought about where some of the money could be going.
I’m not religious personally, but I think the John 3:16 on the bag has a better chance of making someone who believes happy, than offending someone (like me) who doesn’t believe.
THis topic is very interesting! I feel that if a company wants to put a scripture on their bag then it is a Great idea. For those of you that are offended, why is it offensive? This man has nothing but good intentions and you can choose to let it effect you or go on about your day. Its just there and not forced upon you.
SOmeone brought out the point that we as americans have the freedom of speach to speak our minds. And John 3:16 written on bags is the same as bumper stickers on cars and images and obscene slogans written on clothing. Wouldnt you rather see them advertising something positive and encouraging versus something negative? Matter of fact, it can be somewhat similiar to the fortune cookies that come with chinese food. These things like the scripture may be offensive, but have they stopped doing it? No! You can not go around worrying about offending people because there are just wayyyyy too many people in this world with different views and beliefs, so there will always be someone dissatisfied. You can either choose to support Forever 21 or not. It is really not that hard.
Also, for those of you who say that you dont want to support Forever 21 or other religious groups because you dont know what there doing…then why do you buy things period? The reason I ask this is because most companies, stores, etc support things of this sort. Take a look at the tv during commercials they are always saying “this program was supported by Toyota” or “We at McDonalds support Muscular Distrophy”, etc…And this is the same exact thing…now do you REALLY know what they are doing? To me it sounds like you have a problem with religion versus not knowing what the religious group is doing. Also, there may be stores that you buy from that represent or support religion, but you may not know about it. So does that mean that you wont buy from stores at all?
Point well made, Pretty Misses. I concur.
I don’t think it’s horrifying, just awful weird. It’s not like it’s telling anyone to go out and kill Muslims, which is good. I’ve always thought that people who quote the Bible like that were a little kooky. My suggestions, either decide that you love Forever 21 more than you hate psycho-Christians, or break into their store and cover up all the verses with sharpie. Maybe even write in your own!!!
Zoe, perhaps you’re a little kooky. No, psycho is more like it. Come on, break into the store and cover up the verses with a sharpie. Give me a break.
It freaks me out a little for the same reasons–is my money being used to support something that I don’t believe in? It’s the same reason I don’t use Curves Gym–I don’t want my money being used to fund abortion terrorism.
Maybe they put it on the bottom of their bags because its true. God did give His only Son to die for our sins so that we may have eternal life. awesome isn’t it =]
wow… i noticed that also and all i have to say is i hate it when people try to preach religion in any possible way they can. HAVE SOME SELF CONTROL BIBLE THUMPERS!!!
oh and by the way, god isn’t real. call me whatever you please but, we can all agree that religion is a business; the practices bring sooo much money into the church. sure, they do nice things for poeple…sometimes but, all religions are clearly a contraversal topic and get so in depth that it cause violence. WARS PEOPLE! WAR! is it really worth to believe in? Humans killing other humans? canabalism?
you may ask where my faith lies. simple. PEACE & LOVE. i love everyone no matter what. i just very much dislike religion because of the hate it brings into society.
think about this…
i dont see a big deal at all, its about time someone did something POSITIVE for a change, whats it matter where the money goes anyways, do u people really care? when u donate a shirt or whatever to charity do u worry about where it will end up? no. so i commend in n out and forever 21 for not being afraid to show what they believe in… kudos to them!
I don’t think this is anything to freak out about. You disagree with them, so what? If you like their product, then you should keep going there. As consumers, we don’t know where most of our profit dollars go. We could be supporting pretty much anything. It’s possible that other stores could be selling clothes made by some child in a third-world factory earning pennies a day. I doubt that is the case with Fovever 21 because it’s totally inconsistent with Christian beliefs. My point is just there are a lot of things that should freak you out a lot more than a Bible verse. Also, being open minded means being tolerant of beliefs that you don’t agree with.
Why do you care where your money goes? You bought clothes does it really matter what the producer does with it? You got clothes! And if a bible verse freaks you out then you need to start worrying about other things.
Ok so that really bothers me– I’m from CA and teh In n out thing has always been weird to me. But to play devil’s advocate:
Why are we so scared of Christianity? Would we react the same if there was a reference to the Koran? the Torah? what about a saying of Confucious or a quote from the Dali Lama?
This isn’t just about religion– it’s about our phobia of Christianity. It’s about all of those awful memories of being mobbed by envangelizing nuts on campus, at parks, at the beach, etc.
Christians feel the need to bring god into EVERYTHING– I’m simply overloaded… and I’m resentful of feeling so jumpy that even a bible reference on the bottom of a bag sets me off.
To all of you Christians out there (especially Nicole of the April 4th comment), BACK OFF! People might be more interested in talking to you if they weren’t constantly mobbed by pro-Jesus crap.
(before you Jesus freaks jump on me– let me just say that I know what I’m talking about: I’m a former pastor’s kid… It wasn’t until I finally got out of it all that I realized how counter productive it all was…)
Suszie, I just wanted to let you know that you dont need to be so full of hate. And calling Christians, Jesus freaks? … you should be glad Christians don’t call you a pathetic and faithless idiot. Just because you don’t believe in God, do not condemn others who do. After all, you are not the brightest or most wise, many Christians have reasons to believe in what they believe in. Don’t pretend to be so smart and above all others because you don’t necesarily know more than everyone. I don’t mind at all that you disagree with Christianity or the Bible verses printed on forever21 bags, but when you point your finger at Christians and call them idiots, I believe you are offending every Christian out there. I also would like to point out that, sure Christianity seems to have done many bad things to this world; war, slavery blah blah. But anyone with a brain would know better that it isn’t what’s wrong with the religion but those who preach it. Christianity, like many other religions have been misused and manipulated by those in power for their own benefits, but we can’t judge the religion based on these people. It’s like how we think all muslims are terriorists, this belief is not only untrue but rediculously off from the muslim faith. And if we were to call all Muslims idiots or terrorists, i think we are being stereotypical. So, the same thing with Christianity, I hope you can open your eyes and heart to other people’s reasons and stop acting as if you know everything.
replying to Nah’s comment on the fact that all religions are a business, true but tell me what in your life is not a business? you live and make your every move so you can make money, and the soul purpose behind making money is to make yourself happy. For those religious people out there who can not be satisfied with shallow superfical goods, they seek God to find contentment. Whether you call God a created business or what not, He seems to bring people more happiness than sadness, that is if you believe in God. For those God-hatters out there, I don’t know how you can find true happiness in this world, just look around you, is there fairness in anything anymore? Teens baving sex, aids, rape, murders and all that, can you honestly provide a better solution to all these issues with your Godless science? While Christians and other religious people do not point their fingers are you “faithless” people and call you stupid, maybe you should pay some respect for their tolerance of your offensiveness. I mean are those religious people so bad? after all, when you make fun of them they dont come after you with a gun and shoot you in the head, which i believe most un-religious, full -of-hatepeople would do.
Nah,
Its not about religion its about relationship. Remember no matter what you believe now, in the end every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that GOD IS REAL. Please get it together before its too late.
Think about that…
He’s standing up for what he believes in. If you stood up for what you believe in and people disagreed by not buying the clothes you make. Would that stop you?
I think a lot of us ex-Christians get a little riled up whenever we feel like religion is being thrust upon us, even from well meaning or unthreatening sources. Forever21’s owner does have the right to print whatever he wants on his bags, as long as it isn’t offensive, and the one he picked isn’t really. He has the right to be a faith-based company and if some of us don’t like that, we won’t shop there. If you feel you can overlook that and respect his beliefs while maintaining your own, you’ll go right on shopping. It’s as simple as that.
I noticed the scripture on the bag, and have decided not to purchase clothes there anymore. I am atheist, and while it has nothing to do with his right to post the scripture on the bag, I just don’t want to support something I don’t agree with. I despise religion because I have had horrible experiences with it in the past. He has every right to place it on the bag…and I hope he continues if it is something that bring him happiness (after all, he created the business he should be happy with it). I don’t think it is a big deal, but I also don’t agree with all the “accepting Christians” that are telling you to grow up. I think you should make your decision and stick with it.
(on a side note…i find it a little creepy to be chanting lines from a book)
To Vancity…I have already posted that I am atheist, so you know where my stance is. I find your posts to be completely misinformed. I am not going to try to convince you that God does not exist, for all I know He might. I will let you in on a little secret though there have been plenty of Christians that have fought their point of view with guns and murder. Not all “faithless” people are rude and close minded. There are many from all faiths and non-faiths that have closed minds as well as open minds. I just wish the close minded Christians could just accept people the way they claim to. I have met plenty that do and plenty that don’t. I don’t force my opinion on anyone because it is just that…and opinion. I wish nobody would call me stupid, intolerable, or try to tell me I am going straight to hell for not believing.
On another note, I seek peace in the good things in my world. While you focus on teens having sex, rape, AIDS, etc. I focus on the beauty of nature, my amazing family, my fantastic boyfriend, and all the wonderful things I have to be thankful for. While you blame these things on God, I blame them on luck, coincidence, karma…You cannot make non-religious people look at all the bad in the world and tell them this is what not believing gets you, and all the great things in the world can be attributed to God. I think all good and bad are to be blamed on the same thing…human race. We are good people and we are bad people…this is the world we have come up with.
it is freaky! but at the same time it’s not the worst thing the church has done in the past. And i’m sure it was done with the best intentions by the owner. although i feel that it’s not the best marketing move. by trying to appeal to only one religious group, he is excluding all the customers of other beliefs.
This just goes to show that ignorance is bliss. Before you knew about F21’s religious orientation, you could care less where your money went. God forbid you look up something significant, like whether they use child labor or not. I think it’s great that F21 is at least being up front about where they stand. So many companies donate to campaigns without publicizing it, because they want the political lenience but don’t want to be called out on it.
There are whole websites devoted to which companies donate where (buyblue.org) so maybe check out those before you judge.
Conservatives have long had to make choices about whether to sacrifice a product or else support a liberal agenda / sinful image. It’s about time that people who could care less about traditional morality are faced with the same dilemma.
Thank you taylor for bringing up this point. I feel like we should be more worried about WHERE the clothing that we wear comes from rather than what religion its manufacturer or owner is from. We should be more interested in whether or not our clothing is being produced by child laborers, or even laborers in general, who are working in terrible conditions for despicable wages, than worrying about being converted to a religion or converting non-religious people to your religon. People have the right to believe in whatever they want to without judgement.
I find the verbal abuse that this debate over religions has caused interesting and saddening because this is exactly how many real wars get started; someone saying “I am better than you are because I am this or I believe that”. I am buddhist, but have friends who are both christian and non-religious and we get along fine because we RESPECT EACHOTHER AS PEOPLE, no matter what religion the other is. I doesn’t matter what kinds of terrible things christians, people of other religions or the non-religious have done both presently and in the past, there are some people who have and will always commit atrocities whether they know it or not. This, however, DOES NOT GIVE ANYONE THE RIGHT TO CONDEMN PEOPLE FOR WHAT THEY DO OR DO NOT BELIEVE IN; we are ALL HUMAN BEINGS. Believe that.
I noticed this printed on their bag’s a while ago. I wasn’t offended as much as i was confused. To be honest, I couldn’t care less if he was a Satanist. I was wondering how Christians would react if the phrase “God is fake” was printed on the bottom of the bag.
Just a thought.
Don’t like it, don’t shop there. It’s not like your 20 bucks is gonna make that big of a difference in their spending capablities.
Forever21 is adorable clothing at inexpensive prices. Even if some small percentage of the money I spend there goes to fund some weirdo mission, I’m not too concerned about it. Maybe my 10% is the portion they use to feed people, and I am not opposed to feeding the hungry so that I can wear a cute dress to a nightclub.
OMG I can’t even believe that people are frecking debating this topic who cares if he put a bible verse on the bag… its not possessed or anything and he’s not preaching religion maybe he just likes the quote and instead of writing the whole quote he just put the verse. And to the person who said God isn’t real maybe he isn’t be he is an emblem of hope for people. some people like the feeling that someone’s always there for you isn’t that what we all want. I can’t freakin out over 4 letters and 3 numbers u should be more worried about other stuff like girls who are getting pregnant while theyre still in junior high… get over yourself.
I don’t see a problem with free speech, nor with the message on the bag, which is love.
What many people miss is that Christ means LOVE. That’s it. Nothing evil, nothing vile, nothing bad. The christian faith views itself as the path to ultimate truth, which is rooted, and no doubt is all-encompassed in love. What is wrong with a message of pure and true love?
We buy emblems that say “love” and “peace” all the time, which is what Christianity is about. Through being Christian, we find truth, beauty, love, and complete inner peace. The religion is not evil and condemns legalism and self-righteousness. I don’t see anything wrong with it. Even if you don’t believe in God, can you not say that you believe in love? truth? beauty? meaning? Let us all find our meaning where it speaks loudest.
I have no problem with what he has chosen to put on his shopping bags. As others have stated he is trying to do something positive. I a world that is very negitive, I find this a welcome change.
Also, I was thinking…….Maybe we should not pay taxes? As most people in the US can agree, there are millions upon millions of dollars spent each year on things that most folks disagree with. If based on a lot of opinions in this post, we follow the same guidelines that are trying to be forced on this business owner, than we should all stop paying taxes.
Now we know that is not going to happen. So that leaves us with two options. Either buy from the store and quit making such a big deal out of it or do not buy from them and research what the other stores do with THERE money. ( You might be surprised as to where it is spent)
Saved by Grace and a Baptist by CHOICE.
If you are so bent out of shape over a bible verse on the bottom of a shopping bag, then don’t shop there. Easy as that. I think it’s awesome they’re standing for something positive and uplifting. I am a strong supporter of F21 and In-n-Out. Both are great companies that are unafraid to express themselves just to appease a vocal minority. Furthermore, if the bag said something like “God is fake” as another posting suggested, I wouldn’t shop there. That is my choice as an American. God Bless everyone.
I don’t think it is any religious organizations’ intent to spread a negative message. Religious freedom and tolerance are the corner stones on which this country was built. These religious messages that have been put under so much scrutiny the past several years are not put there to insult anyone. They are there to show you that there is always a place to turn to, whether it be the Holy Bible, the Quran, or the Upanishads. If the money you spend on your next Saturday night club wear goes to a nobler cause that brings joy to the milling millions on this rock, I would say it was money well spent. What should be more of a concern are the people who are exploited around the world so you can look oh so adorable!
What is so AWFUL about a Bible verse? Don’t any of you kids know anything??
ok people so what the hell is the big f***ing deal so what he wanted to put something on HIS BAG. right now i don’t have a religion but i do believe in God and i understand that those of u that dont believe in god may not want to shop with f21 because of that verse.but to use that verse as an excuse is a bunch of bullshit!! because each and everyone of us that commented on that BAG spends money on a daily basis and guess what It say in god we trust. so for those of you that want to stop shopping with f21, putting down other peoples faith(and that goes for both believers and non believers), and the others that are in the meddle there are a lot more important things to worry about in the US like the war,hiv,poverty,rape,child abuse,ect.. so get over it people.
ps. for the young lady that posted this question its all on you honey if you like the clothes and they give you a little pick me up now and then . if you can look past it then get them if not do n’t
Bottom line, if you are ‘freaked out’ or offended, don’t support what they stand for by continuing to purchase their product. Either stop complaining or start shopping elsewhere.
Good grief, it is a privately-owned business! I think it’s high time people started standing up for what they believe in instead of repressing their beliefs bc they’re worried about offending someone with different views…someone somewhere is always going to be offended.
i think it’s AWESOME that someone would print this message on a bag. with all the other messages and ads that we are bombarded with in this world, seeing a message of hope is inspiring! rather than shirts and bumper stickers tlling kids to go out, get drunk, get high, and get pregnant.
so why is it such a big deal? this man obviously had good intentions. and he also could have printed it in larger writing or even named the store ‘john 3:16′, which if you are threatened by Jesus, would probably be more intimidating.
this isn’t life threatening at all, and this man is just trying to witness to the world, and has gone about it in a creative, and peacefu way.
and on the subject of Christianity, i don’t want to attack or condemn anyone.
but for one thing, don’t group all Christian’s actions together. there are different ways that some people go about trying to convert others, and there are some that i really don’t agree with.
but, just because you had a bad experience with one Christian, or went to a few bad, or even corrupt churches, please don’t blame God for it.
people are people, after all, we are imperfect, and we make mistakes. but don’t let that ruin your beliefs & salvation.
i say this because i was in a few very dead churches growing up, and had some very pushy people trying to shove God down my throat. they completely turned me against their version of Christianity, and i didn’t know what i believed.
and then i found an AWESOME church.
they teach directly from the bible, and no added-in little fillers that confuse you, and may be made-up. they renewed my faith & taught me to have a relationship with God, rather than a religion.
so please give it a try before bashing it. find a good bible based church, but if your heart doesn’t feel right, something is probably wrong, so find another church
but as for me, i’m honored to be called a bible-thumping Jesus freak =)
I think anyone that is going to complain because they are putting verses on there bags has way to much spare time!! Who cares!! It’s a free country and its theit right to put it on there!! Freedom of speech…Freedom of Religion!! It’s not like they are trying to make you believe what they believe they are just showing you who they are!! It’s a personal thing. I think its nice that they share that with us. And I am not a religious person!! I don’t even believe in organized religion but life is to short to complain over simple things that really don’t matter! SO stop making a big deal out of nothing!!
~N~
so…
can i just say something to jambawamba?
you said…
“I have already posted that I am atheist, so you know where my stance is. I find your posts to be completely misinformed. I am not going to try to convince you that God does not exist, for all I know He might.”
if you are open to the possibility that God may exist, you are agnostic… not an atheist.
just thought you might want to get your terms right if you’re going to claim it.
here’s the definition.
An agnostic thinks it impossible to know the truth in matters such as God and the future life with which Christianity and other religions are concerned. Or, if not impossible, at least impossible at the present time.
anyway. who cares what he prints on his bags. it’s his freaking business. if i don’t like it, i have the right to go somewhere that doesn’t print that on the bag.
and someone had said that he is discriminating because he isn’t printing sayings from other religions…
my guess, if he has john 3 16 on his bags, then he doesn’t practice budhism. and once again, it’s his business. if he wanted to put “i hope you have a great fricking day, stupid.” he could because it’s his business.
and if you didn’t like it, then you don’t go there. and if enough people didn’t like it, he’d get the point, but it’s still his choice if he wants to take it off of the bag or not.
I dont personally think its a big deal… as far as the money goes who knows where the money we spend goes… the owner of american eagle or old navy could be donating to pro life or pro abortion organizations or maybe some other organization that no one knows about…do you see what i’m saying? the fact of the matter is, is that were all consumers, and especially as females were most likely going to buy something solely because we like it not thinking about who made the clothes… where they came from… or where the money goes… i would imagine the verses are a form of pride in whatever beliefs are had and in hope to send out an uplifting message, which i dont think is disrespectful in any way… here we go with the freedom of speach thing again… goes both ways…
and p.s. alana……
VERY good point with the money comment
“in god we trust” is most definitely printed on of our money and has been that way since it was created! if it wasnt for the ppl of our past we flat out wouldnt be here… i agree that religion has been corrupted by radicals and ppl who decided to capitalize on it and use it to PROFIT… notice i say profit not make money because depending on the church they have to make money for general up keeping… BUT religion has been the grounds for almost every nation no matter what religion that may be.. so obviously those ppl knew what they were talking about to some extent so why argue with it… i think ppl should spend more time protesting against rapists and murders being let out of jail or parents getting away with beating their kids or kids doing drugs… seriously there are more serious important things going on that need attention other than who believes in what… we all need to just leave eachother alone personally and put aside our differences (differences which are inevitable) and come together as a whole to fix the real problems of this world
thanks kattie
this is to nah on the comment from april 4 okay the person that gave their opinion you commented was their opinion that is what this is for. i dont think they were preaching. ya some people who call their selves christians cause chaos some do not i think it is judgmental to say we do some things good but mostly cause wars and kill. so you are a non-believer that is fine that is your right but how many non believers kill and start wars . people are people we are all human we all make mistakes. im christian, i go to church but i havent preached to you about my religion , i do good things and i do things im not proud of . we all do. dont try to be so “preaching” yourself
Okay, first off, rob (from June 14th) maybe go back to grade 4 for some punctuation lessons; your comment made my head hurt.
Back on topic, I didn’t realize Forever 21 had that message on the bottom of their bags. I am using one as a garbage bag (how fitting) so I will check it out when I get home. Maybe it’s different in Canada… I guess if you don’t like the message, then don’t buy the clothes. Also, if you are really against supporting companies that have opposing viewpoints to your own, do your research (although you might not like what you find). A lot of companies are owned by hard core Christians For instance, Domino’s Pizza. Their president/CEO doesn’t think women should have the right to vote! Best of luck!
Religious or not ppl have to agree that putting bible verses on the bottom of a shopping bag is a good sign. I am twenty years old and i make fun of forever 21 becuase they have the most ugly cloth. however after knowing of this ( secret ) statement underneath their bag i will go inside and see the clothes with a different perspective. This world needs bible verses. Look at the news, just that alone makes me want to go to church on sundays. It’s funny how ppl can critisize others for trying to bring good, yet complain when they hear something bad happened. Religious or not this world needs more stuff like this and less video games that teach kids how to kill. Maybe then, ust maybe then, ppl would stop posting up negative comments and be thankful that a store that big is taking time to reming others of what and who is God.
i really dont think its anything to be upset about or to be made a big deal over. so the man who owns the store likes the bible verse. so do i and im not religious at all. its kinda like a poem or something, imagine if he put a quote from shakespeare instead would u still be trippin? hes not passing out bibles or filers at the door or tryin to “spread the word”, not telling anyone who they need to believe in or not to believe in.its just a bible verse that he likes, and he does have that right this is america last time i checked. im pretty sure you have done or said something that that man wouldnt like and you dont see him putting up web sites talkin about your business do you? to be honest i dont even know why u are wasting time and energy on something as stupid as this. and i dont know why im wasting my time writing this either im out.
okay having that on the bottom of a shopping bag is bull s**t seriosly i am pagen(witch craft)and its hard because with all the racial and religous debates it is hard not to get judged for what you believe in and i DISAGREE because the Triqurta the new sybol for the holy spirit was pagen before any thing else and they recently stole it and now clamming at there own and putting salt around a house after a ritual clinsing is pagen to it has been in our religon for thousnads of yearsand the same for using lavendar to cleanse properties and houses so i think its s**t that they still stuff from our religon then burn us at the steaks and now butting god damn bible vrses on bags that every religion shops at they should get sued for it honstly because like racial discrimination it is religous discrimination.
I noticed that a while ago too, and although as a non-christian it doesn’t offend me, it is a little off-putting what that particular verse is saying about non-christians.
1.Just because they put a verse on a bag doesnt mean they are trying to force a religion on you! i dont understand why anyone would be offended..do you think that because they buy something from the store that means they agree with the persons religion. its your own choice what religion you have.
2.They wrote John 3:16 - they didnt write the actual verse on the bag! just ignore it and move on its not a big deal
i think the bible verse on the bag is GREAT!!
if you dnt like it dnt shop there!!!
for those interested, and who don’t know… F21’s do come from sweatshops, which most likely include child labor and horrible working conditions… but then again, so are so are the clothes that come from cheaper stores… anything from Charlotte Rousse to Target..
I was saddened when I found out, but then again, what can we do? Boycott EVERYTHING? sadly we can’t…
PEOPLE IT IS HIS STORE AND HIS BAG why with all thats going on are we still on this if i had my own store i would want it to rep. me and if its by putting up my flag,or rainbows,or elmo whateva it is reping me and my store i know some people may not like it but guess what its mine. it like me saying that i like blue and you hate it just because you hate it do you think i will stop liking blue?
i think that it is great! and God bless the owner and all who support the idea of John 3:16 on the bags;)
its funny how this man is being persecuted because he chooses to speak out about his religion on his bags from his store!!! A democracy runs on freedom of speech. This bible verse expresses how much God loves us - that he sacrificed his son Jesus as payment for our sins and a chance of redemption, and that he is willing and able to forgive us. So him chooseing to share about his God with the public is more of him saying don’t worry there is someone who loves u unconditionally, who is always there for u and is waiting patiently for u to seek his face. Its like this - if u came upon something so great it left u in awe wouldn’t u wnat to share it with the world? wouldn’t u want other ppl to share in it? i don’t think he has any intention to offend anyone and it is unfortunate that ppl are offended. By him sharing this verse he is doin what God wnats of us… so in the long run he will benefit when that day comes… he is workin out his salvation here on earth and is trying to help u work urs out 2!
Not sure if its been covered, but you should be bringing in your own reusable shopping bags when you go shopping. Just keep them in your car, on your porch, whatever. It is a SIMPLE and effective way to show the earth you care.
So you’re worried that this funds religious organizations you don’t approve of? But you approve of outsourcing to the third world?
O ,ean you’re worried about how they might use the profits to fund the church but until you saw that Bible verse you never thought about how the owners might use their profits or how they even make such huge profits??
I’m pretty sure there are worse things. Also, I’nm going to say that most Christians give what they can to their church and Forever 21 isn’t the only store owned by Christians.
If you’re prejudiced enough to boycott this store just because it’s run by people who are openly Christian you might want to consider that most companies have people reaping large profits and putting that money toward things you might not approve of.
Do you buy gas? Who do you think that money goes to? Where do you think it comes from?
How about any large company?
You are willing to pay for the clothes to fund a company, why do you care what it does with the money. Get what you want and don’t worry yourself so much with what other people do. They could be using the money for ALOT worse things than funding a church, considering how much community service alot of churches do. Maybe in the end oyu will even benefit from that.
I assume you have written articles in the past wondering what sweatshop or child labor factory your money goes to when you shop at other stores?
What if the clothing sold at Forever 21 is also made in some overseas sweatshop by child labor (hint: the price of their merchandise indicates signs point to “yes”)? On the one hand Forever 21 is engaging in a dubious, immoral behavior. On the other, they are enriching the world by bringing the sweet promise of employment to children in the third world! ;-0~
ok
this person needs re-think her crap. the only people who get offended by other peoples so called beleifs are people who are uncertain about their own. if you want answers then quit writing this stupid article on some website and go obtain answers go ask the dude who put it there. be a lil more proactive instead of bitching on the net do something “all these questions and a pile of clothes!” wtf is up with that? there is always an answer to every question. so go find w/e your looking for! jeez! and since you used to be apart of the church you should no that its not about spreading propaganda its about saving all those people who dont beleive its to save all those people from HELL!
i work for ForLove21 and the reason for the bible verse is because he came here like every other immigrant and started his businesses from nothing. so what if he’s religious? the reason for the verse is to say that he is thankful for how far he has come. no money gets donated to churches or funds you don’t know about.
if you hate it so bad and are so against it then dont shop there..what this world needs is god and how are we going to get out of global warming or this war without him..were not sadly..so start believing & stop putting people down..its his store not yours.
in-n-out has a few different verses on their hamburger bags and the ones on their soda and milkshake cups, and i certainly don’t have a problem with it! i don’t really shop at forever 21, but i think it’s cool that they put verses on their bags. it just goes right along with freedom of religion. i think if they were to donate any part of your money to any sort of organization, religious or not, they would tell you or advertise it. it’s awesome how he’s not afraid to show what he believes!
i just found the scripture verse on the bag last night
i was suprised but i was happy because i think it’s a wonderful thing that people (or stores in this case) are showing this because it might actually make someone open up a bible and read the verse
i don’t see why you would have such a problem with it? believe the verse or don’t believe it, (by the way you really should because there is a God who loves you so much that he gave his only Son to die for us so that we can live in heaven with him)but it’s your choice and i agree with justagirl; i think it’t great that he’s not afraid to show what he believes
and let’s just say that the money is going towards a charity or some fundraiser…is it really that bad? that maybe you’re helping a family in Africa or something somewhere that needs that money that is dying of starvation or malnutrition? i think that they would tell you anyway if that’s where the money was going
but those are my thoughts
and by the way, i really do hope that if you have a Bible, you read it and start a personal relationship with Jesus Christ
he changed my life and he can change yours too, but you have to be willing
heres a quick comment if it freaks u out so much then dont shop there anymore i appreciate someone taking a stance on their faith no mtter what religion they am
srry typo no matter what religion they are
I don’t believe ANYONE is making you shop there, so if you don’t like the bags… GET OVER IT! and seriously are you going to judge a store based on a bag that the clothes come in? Is that what you’re going to the store to purchase? If you don’t like the bag… THROW IT AWAY! It’s that simple!
I’m a Christin Missionary, who was also raised Roman Catholic. I can understand how unnerving it can be to go to your favorite store merely looking to get a cute outfit and be confronted with ideas about something as heavy as “ultimate reality of faith.” But I think its a testiment to how serious this issue of faith really is.
Christianity is now the only religion that has been refused as a whole to be supported by faith-based governmental grants. Islam, Taoism, Shinto, and Buddism all can recieve such money with no problems…I say this to point out that Christianity is under attack, while other religions are praised. As a fellow critical thinker, I encourage you to ask why only this one…why not all? Is it random, arbitary? or something more?
I’m not making a “plug” for you to join “my side” I’m sure you’ve gotten enough of that. Its only when you ask questions that you can come to a deeper understanding of anything….the nature of the Divine is no different.
In fact, I applaud you for not being apathetic, as so many of our generation are. Also, I would love to see if your misconceptions about Christianity and faith were the same as mine (having shared the same Catholic dogma).
Best of luck on your journey!
I am an atheist and frankly I am quite offended with all the comments telling people like me to grow up. It is a bit annoying to me to see Bible references and Christian icons everywhere I go. In someone’s house is one thing but out in the public is quite another. If I wanted Bible verses I’d go to church. Not to get into a religious debate here, but one of the reasons I am not Christian is because many Christian organizations and churches near me are so in-my-face about it that they push me farther away. Realizing this verse was referenced on Forever XI bags will definitely make me reconsider shopping there in the future, because my money is going to: not someone religious (that wouldn’t bother me), but someone who is religious and thrusting their religion in my face and in other’s faces, which I find extremely offensive.
What is so wrong with spreding a little hope around, by the owner of forever21 puttin bible verses on his bags he isn’t telling you to join or give money to his “organized church” and I use that freely. He only whats to let people ya (you) know that Jesus loves you and when he died had you , thats wright YOU! YOUR NAME! YOUR LIFE! Was in his mind. He is how he says he is and to those how belive it is importan to share that with others. Point blank Jesus lives andhe lives in YOU!
It’s not as if the verse were quoted in its entireity - just the means of looking it up. How offensive can that possibly be?
It has become almost fashionable to bash Christians who are openly Christian. Would you have complained if there had been a reference to the Koran on the bag? I doubt that you would have even known it was from the Koran and gone on in blissful ignorance.
If you are so “spiritual” why can’t you allow others to be spiritual in their own chosen way? If you are allowed to practice your beliefs any way you please without fear of others being “offended”, then so should everyone else NO MATTER WHAT.
Apparently, you are one of those thin-skinned people who give this country (indeed, the world) a bad name. If you are so easily offended, wear a blindfold or become a hermit. I have just as much right to be a practicing Christian (or Hindu, Buddist, Muslim, Wiccan, etc.) as you do, without your complaining about it.
Get a life. If you are spending your time blogging about an “offensive” shopping bag, you don’t really have one.
People came to this country in search of religious freedom. The ability to believe in whatever they want to believe in. If you belive in God, great!, if not, that’s YOUR choice and that’s okay if you feel good about it. But it’s like someone said earlier, it’s his choice whether or not he wants a bible verse on his bag. I myself am a Christian and I find it refreshing that he is just trying to spread a little love and hope. But please explain something to me Sara, how is the most well known verse on THE BOTTOM of a shopping bag being “in your face”? You probably didn’t even know it was there until you read this.
you have issues
just buy the damn tank top and stop worrying about where the $$ is going
if you dont agree with missionary programs (and if u dont, u seriously are disturbed not wanting to help ppl) than instead of buying a tank top where some of the profits MIGHT go 2 something worth while than YOU be the bigger person and use the $$ to something of ur own approval
jerk
… bigotry is so lame these days
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